Southern Avenger

If the State sues the Fed to stop mandatory health care coverage; doesn’t North Carolina risk loosing any federal funding for Medicaid or federal funding for state supported hospitals treating the indigent at no costs? I was under the impression that one of the main issues of health care reform was to cover everyone so as to stop the uninsured from using Emergency Rooms as doctors offices for free.

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I think there will be a lot of opposition to this 'reform'. However, that said I think it will stick and I don't see it being reversed. This is partly because of what Jack Hunter said. In the end all parties like big government and this is certainly big government in the extreme. Also remember that in the future there will be endless political capital to be made for a politician who says they will improve the system and give people even more. In Europe improving health care is always one of the promises politicians make when seeking to win elections.

The deeper point is that all these changes alter the nature of America. This makes returning impossible.

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Reader Out of State,

You may be right on your point of:

"The deeper point is that all these changes alter the nature of America. This makes returning impossible."

Please don't give up just yet. America has a pretty good track record of doing the impossible. This socialist state will collapse under its own weight, and because the American people expect and demand instant gratification, the collapse will happen very quickly.

Franklin"s theory that "the best way to remove people from a state of poverty is to make them uncomfortable in it" will provide the impetus for tearing down Big Government. When government fails to deliver on its promises and the economy really tanks, the newly poor, formerly middle class of America will remember that economic freedom and lower taxes leads to a smaller, less intrusive government. Smaller, less intrusive government will permit the new poor to remove themselves from poverty very quickly.

The real question is whether or not the cycle will repeat itself again in another 40 to 60 years.

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As long as the Tea Partyers consist exclusively of white heterosexuals, embrace Sarah Palin as their de facto leader and shout out racial and homophobic slurs at U.S. legislators, they will continue to be regarded as a hate-filled fringe group of the Republican Party, which in itself is considered to be a mean-spirited party. Neither will be given any real credence.

"Big Government" is a vacuous, all-inclusive term that means nothing in and of itself. Until the Tea Partyers realize who the actual power brokers are, and how far their power extends, they will have accomplished nothing.

For instance, are they willing to address the role of the Religious Right and its allies in forming U.S. foreign and domestic policy? Are they willing to concede the obscene power wielded by the military-industrial complex in determining both foreign policy and the federal budget? These are the true enemies of liberty and fiscal responsibility. They have become so entrenched in the system that nothing short of an act of God will change the status quo.

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Brad you may be correct about the Tea Parties. I don't know I have no involvement. As far as I can judge they are not homogeneous. Certainly the establishment Republicans are seeking to exert their influence. But all this has nothing to do with The Southern Avenger or I suspect many of the posters here.

What you should do Brad is listen extensively to Ron Paul. If you did you would hear answers to all the questions posed in your last paragraph.

There is nothing wrong with your points but I am mystified as to why you post them here. Those criticisms belong somewhere else.

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Democrats, Republicans, TeaParty, BigGoverment,all these are irrelevant, wake up America!! Nothing, And I mean nothing, will change or get any different until we realize we must vote out all, let me repeat, all incumbents, period. The pollticians in Washington now are the same people who got us into this economic mess we are in today! Have you recieved your stimulus check yet? Ha!! America, we must vote for men and women who have a proven track record in business. CEO's who have turned co's around. People who will vote for term limits. Vote to abolish Lobbying,which is no more than legal bribery.

Without term limits, politicians, get embedded with lobbyists and then we don't matter anymore. It turns into what they can do to make there lives richer.

Don't let history repeat it self. Look were it's got us!

Remember were still getting screwed by the same politicians that put this great country of ours in the shape it's in today.

VOTE for CHANGE! VOTE at EVERY CHANCE YOU GET!

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The two words which Washington now needs to hear are nullification and secession. Law suits will have to be filed in the Fed's own courts. Who could possibly expect a positive outcome by playing on their turf. Won't happen.

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Reader Out of State, that's the kindest, gentlest rejection I've ever received. I feel like I should be thanking you.

My point was that if Mr. Hunter is so concerned with fiscal responsibility and reducing the national debt, why doesn't he urge Tea Partyers to demonstrate at the steps of the Pentagon, at the huge corporations that subcontract for the military, or at the think tanks whose sole purpose it is to think up ways to sell the American public on new wars? The military-industrial complex eats up a lot more of our tax-payer dollars than does health care.

The whole controversy seems just a little too tailor-made for Republicans.

I've listened to Ron Paul interviews many times. His views are more Libertarian than Republican. His calls for a radical change in the size and scope of the federal government and for a completely unregulated free market sound good in theory. I'm just not sure how well they translate in a nation of over 300 million people.

I voted for the Libertarian presidential candidate in the last election because his first priority was to balance the national budget. I will vote for Dr. Paul in 2012-- not because I swallow his views hook, line and sinker-- but because he values principles over party loyalty or opinion polls. And because this country really does need a radical change of direction.

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Brad I don't know everything that the Southern Avenger thinks or believes in. I would suspect that all the things you pin point as reprehensible would also be an anathema to him.

I know more about Ron Paul and certainly I have never heard from any politician such outright condemnation of the military industrial complex, corporation, the CIA and empire.

As for economics I do understand what you are saying. After all in these matters what is often presented is theory and life can be very different. There can be some things that we can be sure of. We know what we have now. We know or at lest we can judge if we think it good or bad or in between.

So we have some knowledge. If economic success is the measuring stick then I think I can see that in some areas the free market it is successful. I don't necessarily think that this makes it righteous or that exploitation is not part of it. What I am saying is that within the domain of human imperfection it works well enough for me. So I am happy with say my ability to buy shoes and food.

Now I actually pay an large amount for my water which is private. On the other hand I did live in a country where the water was provided communally and it was cheep. The trouble is in first case I was in a city and in the second I was in a village.

What I am trying to say is that I agree that there is not necessarily certainty in these matters. Cases may vary.

I think for me the choice is easier as I put personal liberty ahead of any economic considerations. I seek freedom above wealth. I would rather have a little which is mine than a lot which I am directed how to use.

I want to be able to own property as an individual. If you are a man then you may find that this is impossible since previous and future property may be confiscated from you by the state and given to another person as part of divorce.

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@Brad: You are absolutely INCORRECT regarding the make up of the Tea Party. They are white, black, Asian, they are repubs, dems, independents, constitutionalists and libertarian, Sarah Palin is not the leader of this movement (although she certainly has her place with it) and there isn't any proof, none, zero, zilch, that any racial slurs were hurled at the US legislatures during the "peaceful" protest in Washington last week. As dishonest and deceiptful as politicans are how do we know that there are not "plants" in crowds of people, from both sides? Tea Partyers do know who the power brokers are, it's WE THE PEOPLE, sir. And that power will be demonstrated in November! And as far as the "obsene" power of our military, don't forget who has sacraficied their blood and lives to protect YOU! And if it wasn't for our free economy and the most productive industrial country in the world, you sir, wouldn't be sitting at your desk making negative slurs at our country and it's free enterprise. The United States is not a NANNY STATE and never will be. Stand up America and stop this secular progressive movement from taking away our liberties!

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Reader Out of State, thank you for your honest, intelligent and civil response. I appreciate your reminding me of one of the cornerstones of conservative thought: that human nature will always be flawed and imperfect.

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I think if this issue is such an emergency, then in november 26 senate seats and 119 house seats will get flipped. Take it to the polls, guys. Last I heard the people are the deciders.

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How is it that love and compassion have become dirty words to so many Americans? Are these not the building blocks of community?

Sure the healthcare bill is compromised by the interests of powerful corporations. It's not what it should be. Those are political realities. But at its heart--it's an effort to help people in need, and millions of Americans will benefit. I strongly suspect that Jack Hunter will take advantage of the new healthcare reforms.

Hunter is correct to point out GOP hypocrisy on this issue, but no one should be ashamed for taking action that helps their brothers and sisters keep their health.

What sort of a nation celebrates cruelty?

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"What sort of a nation celebrates cruelty?"

A Republican/Teabagger nation.

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The Tea Party are already blind partisans. They are blind to the fact that the Tea Parties are coalescing into the far right wing of the republican party. The vast majority of Tea party adherents self-identify as republicans. The real sad issue is that most of Tea party nation has been funded by republican dollars and they will represent the failed policies of the republican party. They even believe that the health care bill will be stopped in the courts and don't appreciate the irony that republicans are endorsing judicial activism.

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45xtu21,

You wrote, "The real sad issue is that most of Tea party nation has been funded by republican dollars".

Really? You would think that for all the money the Republicans are spending, they could buy the Tea Party protesters some professionally printed signs with unified, focus group approved messages. And why haven't the Republicans used their influence and power over the Tea Party to remove that parties' candidates from challenging Republican incumbents?

And how do you know so much about the Tea Party?

Have you secretly infiltrated the ranks to learn their evil plans for world domination? Can you tell us what the secret handshake is? Where do they find those clever disguises that make Right Winger Nazis look like our grandmothers, truck drivers and working class schlubs?

So the Tea Party is coalescing into the far right wing of the Republican party, eh? Would that be like what happened when the Progressives started coalescing into the far left wing of the Democratic Party? Does this mean that "centrist" conservatives like Lindsey Graham will be neutered? (One can only dream) Who is the Tea Party equivalent of the progressive's bag man George Soros? What are the Tea Parties' plans with regard to corrupting the education system, man's relationship with God, civility and charity?

We need answers, and since you have already established "cover" within the organization, perhaps you can find the answers for us. Please be careful, though. If you slip up and get caught, there's no telling what those crazies might do to you. One misstep, and you will find yourself in front of Glenn Beck's blackboard, writing paragraphs from the federalist papers until your fingers break and your eyes bleed.

You can't be to careful, Comrade. Since the Patriot Act, the right has spies everywhere.

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I also wish to see compassion. I also want people's lives to be better not worse. I can not however believe that this can be accomplished by any sort of state bureaucracy which in the end will only be interested in its own wealth and privilege.

There is no such thing as a compassionate bureaucracy. In fact bureaucracies are the antithesis of compassion.

These things may take many years to unfold. The situation develop over a long period of time. In England where they have had what they call the National Health Service for 60 years here are a few points that you might not know.

I the UK over 80% of National Health spending is on women's health. Men only get what's left over. There are at least two national screening programs for women, there are none for men.

You see that's what happens when the individual is removed from consideration. The government allocates resources according to its prejudice and political preferences.

Remember the state only ever has two institution for men - prisons in time of peace and the infantry in times of war.

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