Sunday, May 24, 2009

Is Waterboarding Torture?

Posted by Jack Hunter on Sun, May 24, 2009 at 2:33 PM

At WTMA Richard Todd and I have been debating with many callers who don't believe waterboarding constitutes torture. We've been pointing out that Teddy Roosevelt did, Ronald Reagan did , and now Chicago radio host Mancow apparently does too:

Topics: National Politics
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Where are the videos of Daniel Pearl and Nicholas Berg getting their heads sawed off from the front to the back? Are the (animal like) screams they make too much for ya? Me too.

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Posted by hellhound4hire on May 24, 2009 at 11:18 PM

Never again will torture be considered a war crime. We will never be able to prosecute anyone who tortures an American POW because we opened the door for it.

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Posted by Jason Usry on May 25, 2009 at 9:42 AM

Of course it is torture. If it wasn't - we would justify using it on suspected murderers and other criminals who could lead us to additional crimes (or prevention of crimes to come). The problem with all of this is, of course, torture is never used to gain information you don't have - it's used to gain information you want/need.

Pearl and Berg were brutally murdered and it shocks the conscience that people could treat anyone like that. But who are we to begin the decline downward to those those tactics?

I've posted it before and I'll post it again. Waterboarding was used by Pol Pot and the perpetrators of the Spanish Inquisition. There is NO sane reading of the Geneva or UN Conventions on torture that could lead one to believe it is legal.

This sad and reprehensible behavior will scar our history (and hurt our international credibility on human rights) for years to come.

One more point - I am a big believer in the military's rules of engagement. If you are in a battle zone and you pose a threat to a single hair on our soldier's head - you will die. But if you are captured or surrender - we will afford you the basics of human dignity - regardless of your allegiance. We are a better country than this.

BnB

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Posted by BourbonandBranch on May 26, 2009 at 4:00 PM

IMO That's not torture, that's intimidation. If they did physical bodily harm too him, beat him, burned him, electrocuted him, cut him, THAT is torture. Waterboarding does not result in any physical damage to someone. It results in them FEELING like they are going to drown (if they did drown, it would be murder, that's why they have the EMT or a medic standing by). People talk about a "shock to the consciense", but simply living life can "shock the conscience". If waterboarding should be illegal, then so should every other method we use for making terrorist "uncomfortable" when we want information from them, i.e. sleep deprivation and loud music. Just because it's a MORE ACUTE "discomfort" doesn't mean permanent damage is done. They are physically just as fine walking out of the room as they were walking in. Psychologically, they've just faced death, something people should always remember anyway, but is constantly pushed to the edge of most societies

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Posted by btmims on May 29, 2009 at 1:49 AM

I'm sorry, I forgot to add: Intimdation, I'm fairly certain, is illegal. I'm just tired of everybody calling it torture. POWs in Vietnam and WWII, THEY were tortured. The intimidation that's been going on today is kiddy stuff compared to what they went through. If a guy assaults somebody (and they live), does he go to trial (and jail) for murder? Of course not. He goes for assault.

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Posted by btmims on May 29, 2009 at 1:54 AM

Would waterboarding be considered torture if it were used on an American POW?

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Posted by Jason Usry on May 29, 2009 at 9:13 AM

BTMIMS - I could accept your argument if you can explain how to reconcile what the U.S. has signed (AKA given its word as a country) vs. what we are doing. Are you saying that waterboarding - torture or not - is not only OK, but in compliance with the conventions we have signed? I don't see how you could interpret that part.

Or maybe you are suggesting that we should have never signed the Geneva and UN conventions on torture. Or maybe you think we should rescind our support of them.

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Posted by BourbonandBranch on May 29, 2009 at 9:50 AM
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